Sulbutiamine (isobutyryl thiamine disulfide) is a synthetic derivative of Vitamin B1 (thiamine). Thiamine was the first B Vitamin to be discovered by researchers. That’s why it’s called B1.
Sulbutiamine is simply two vitamin B1 molecules joined together. This chemical bond helps thiamine more easily cross the blood-brain barrier.
Japanese scientists first synthesized Sulbutiamine in an attempt to quell a health crisis within the Japanese population. After WWII, the Japanese diet largely consisted of rice. This left them deficient in several key nutrients including thiamine.
Insufficient thiamine led to a central nervous system disorder called Beriberi. But supplementing with thiamine alone didn’t help. Because of its poor bioavailability. And a lot of thiamine was needed to cure Beriberi symptoms.
Sulbutiamine is far more bioavailable than standard thiamine. It is fat-soluble (thiamine is water-soluble) which helps it more easily cross the blood-brain barrier.
The discovery of Sulbutiamine cured the Japanese population of a life-threatening disease. And it has since been tested and used throughout the world with much success.
Throughout this article I’ll refer to Sulbutiamine interchangeably with thiamine. Sulbutiamine is the stronger of the two so it’s affects are amplified compared to standard thiamine.
Thiamine is a coenzyme used by your body to metabolize food for energy. And to maintain proper heart, nerve and brain function.
Thiamine also helps digest and extract energy from food. It turns nutrients into adenosine triphosphate (ATP). ATP is the fuel used by your cell’s mitochondria.
And thiamine helps convert carbohydrates into glucose. The energy your body uses for your brain and nervous system.
One more thing about this miracle B-vitamin. Thiamine contributes to the development of myelin sheaths which wrap around neurons to protect them from damage.
Sulbutiamine helps:
- Brain Optimization: Thiamine is critical for increasing focus, energy, and preventing memory loss. And can ward off inflammation. Healthy brain function is crucial for good decision making.
- Neurotransmitters: Thiamine is essential for producing the neurotransmitter acetylcholine (ACh). ACh is used to relay messages between neurons in your brain. And is critical for cognition, learning and memory.
- Mood: Thiamine helps your body withstand stress. A lack of energy can contribute to poor mood and motivation. Thiamine can boost your mood, and defend against depression and anxiety.
Table of Contents
Overview
Sulbutiamine is a synthetic version of Vitamin B1 (Thiamine). Japanese researchers synthesized Sulbutiamine by bonding two B1 molecules.
They developed Sulbutiamine in response to a country-wide health crisis. The Japanese population were severely thiamine-deficient from a rice-only diet. Large numbers of the population were suffering from Beriberi. A central nervous system disorder caused by a lack of thiamine.
Your body does not produce thiamine on its own. So you must get it from food including beef, brewer’s yeast, legumes (beans, lentils), milk, nuts, oats, oranges, pork, rice, seeds, wheat, whole-grain cereals, and yeast.
But thiamine has poor bioavailability. By synthesizing thiamine and producing Sulbutiamine you end up with a fat-soluble compound that is easily digested. And readily crosses the blood-brain barrier.
Sulbutiamine vs. Thiamine: What’s the Difference?
Sulbutiamine is a synthetic version of Vitamin B1 (Thiamine). It is two B1 molecules chemically bonded together.
Thiamine is water-soluble and does not easily cross the blood-brain barrier. Sulbutiamine is a fat-soluble compound that easily crosses the blood-brain barrier.
Sulbutiamine functions in the body just like thiamine. But because it’s more bioavailable it’s more effective than thiamine.
How does Sulbutiamine Work in the Brain?
Sulbutiamine boosts brain health and function in several ways. But two in particular stand out.
- Sulbutiamine is a fat-soluble molecule that crosses the blood-brain barrier more readily than thiamine. Once in your brain, it increases levels of thiamine pyrophosphate (TPP).
Thiamine pyrophosphate (TPP) is directly involved in the citric acid cycle in the brain.
This cycle breaks fatty acids, amino acids and monosaccharides into smaller molecules that produce adenosine triphosphate (ATP) energy for your mitochondria. And provide the building blocks of the molecules needed to produce brain cells.
A deficiency of TPP can eventually show up as Wernicke encephalopathy and Korsakoff syndrome. In our society this syndrome is typically caused by chronic alcoholism. But it can also occur after obesity (bariatric) surgery, Crohn’s disease, anorexia and if you’re on kidney dialysis.
Symptoms of Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome include confusion, inability to form memories, loss of memories and muscle coordination, confabulation (making up stories) and vision changes. And can ultimately (and very rapidly) lead to coma and death.[i]
Less severe cases of thiamine deficiency include fatigue, weight loss, irritability and confusion.
- Sulbutiamine also contributes to the production of the enzyme PDH which is essential in making the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. And for the synthesis of myelin, which forms a sheath around the axons of neurons. Ensuring these neurons can conduct signals.[ii]
The citric acid cycle and enzyme α–KGDH play a role in maintaining optimal levels of the neurotransmitters glutamate, and gamma–aminobutyric acid (GABA).
When thiamine levels decrease, the activity of these enzymes are reduced.[iii]
How things go bad:
We depend on our diet for thiamine. Very little thiamine is stored in your body. And depletion can occur within 14 days.
Thiamine deficiency can be caused by alcoholism, Alzheimer’s Disease, anemia, athletes who reduce food intake, cancer, clogged arteries, Crohn’s disease, diabetes, diarrhea and kidney disease. And even a poor diet.
↓ Low thiamine levels can slow creation of ATP
↓ Low thiamine levels can cause problems with memory, learning, recall and perception
↓ Acetylcholine levels decline
All of these changes can happen at any age. And are a product of the food we eat, what we drink, lifestyle habits, the air we breathe and more.
So Sulbutiamine can help age-related cognitive decline, as well as a student looking to do better in school. By boosting acetylcholine, dopamine and GABA in the brain. And increased brain energy by fueling cell mitochondria with ATP. And building myelin sheaths that protect our neurons.
Sulbutiamine to the rescue
Sulbutiamine is directly involved in the citric acid cycle that provides adenosine triphosphate (ATP) energy for your mitochondria.
Sulbutiamine also plays a role in maintaining optimal levels of the neurotransmitters glutamate, and gamma–aminobutyric acid (GABA). And contributes to the production of the enzyme PDH which is essential in making the neurotransmitter acetylcholine.
Sulbutiamine will boost cognition, memory and decision-making. And has very effective anxiolytic (anti-depressant) qualities.
How does Sulbutiamine feel?
Sulbutiamine is a fat-soluble form of thiamine which crosses the blood-brain barrier. It has been shown to improve glutamatergic, cholinergic, and dopaminergic neurological transmissions. It may also increase the density of D1 dopamine receptors.[iv]
Nootropics users report:
- Sulbutiamine as a study aid. On its own, Sulbutiamine seems to increase attention span for many neurohackers. And when combined with caffeine or any one of the racetams, many report being able to work effortlessly for hours on end. Study and work seems less stressful.
- Boost motivation. Sulbutiamine boosts motivation and many report gives them the drive they need for study or work.
- Increased focus. Sulbutiamine helps provide laser-like focus at work and school. Some report even with the most tedious of tasks. While staying in a very good mood.
- Sociability. Many users report being able to articulate thoughts, and improved speaking ability. Language and your vocabulary seem to flow effortlessly. Thoughts and ideas come with less effort.
- Improved mood. Personally, I’ve found Sulbutiamine to be more effective than any prescription anti-depressant I’ve ever tried. And without the side effects.
You should be able to experience the effects of Sulbutiamine soon after you take it.
The Research
Sulbutiamine Improves Mood
A study at the University of Wales Swansea in the UK worked with 120 young adult females. Study participants took either a placebo or 50 mg thiamine for 2 months. Mood, memory and reaction times were monitored before and after taking the tablets.
The results indicate that after 2 months of thiamine supplementation, the young females:
- Were more clearheaded
- Felt more composed and energetic
- Reaction times improved
- Improved mood.[v]
Sulbutiamine for Chronic Fatigue
If you deal with chronic fatigue, Sulbutiamine may be a better option than another cup of coffee. Or a stimulant.
Researchers at the Hospital Saint-Antoine in Paris studied 326 patients. All suffering from chronic fatigue. Patients were given 400 mg or 600 mg of Sulbutiamine daily. Or a placebo in this double-blind, parallel-group study.
Patients were tested on the 7th and 28th days of the trial. Those that used 600 mg of Sulbutiamine had less fatigue.[vi]
Sulbutiamine Improves Memory
Poor memory is associated with low levels of choline activity in the brain. Choline is a precursor to the neurotransmitter acetylcholine (ACh). ACh transmission between neurons helps in memory formation.
Scientists decided to find out if Sulbutiamine could help boost choline uptake. They gave a group of mice Sulbutiamine for 10 days, and then tested their memory. The findings suggested Sulbutiamine improved memory formation. And it was due to an increase in choline activity in the brain.[vii]
Another study in France involved giving Sulbutiamine or a saline solution to rats for 9 weeks. The results of this study concluded Sulbutiamine provided better working and episodic memory.[viii]
Sulbutiamine Improves Athletic Performance
Many neurohackers use Sulbutiamine for a boost in physical energy. And it’s created some controversy in professional sports.
The Moscow Anti-Doping Center analyzed 16,000 blood samples in a Russian lab in 2009. They were looking for anabolic steroids in athletes.
They found that 100 samples contained Sulbutiamine. These samples were collected in-competition. Indicating that Sulbutiamine was intentionally administered for its “ergogenic and mild stimulating properties”.[ix]
Sulbutiamine Improves Erectile Dysfunction
One small study was conducted with 20 patients suffering from psychogenic erectile dysfunction. This type of ED is defined as the inability to achieve or maintain an erection because of psychologic factors.
The men were given a prescription form of Sulbutiamine ‘Enerion’ for 30-days. 16 of the men showed significant improvement based on the international index of erectile function (IIEF).
3 of 6 men with arterial disorders in their penis showed that Sulbutiamine corrected the problem. The study concluded that erectile dysfunction can be effectively treated with Sulbutiamine.[x]
Dosage Notes
Recommended Sulbutiamine dosage is 400 mg to 1,000 mg per day. Higher doses should be split with one dose in the morning, and the other early afternoon.
Some neurohackers warn about dosing Sulbutiamine too late in the day. It’s mild ‘stimulant’ qualities could interfere with sleep.
If you’re just starting out with Sulbutiamine, we suggest starting with a low dose and see how your body reacts.
Tolerance can be a problem with Sulbutiamine. So when taking it for extended periods, you may find it beneficial to cycle on and off the supplement. For example, take Sulbutiamine for 5 days, and take 2 days off before your next dose.
Sulbutiamine powder tastes nasty. So you’d be advised to take it in capsule form. You can save on the cost of Sulbutiamine by making your own capsules.
And Sulbutiamine is fat-soluble so take it with a tablespoon of extra virgin, cold-pressed coconut or olive oil for better absorption.
Side Effects
Sulbutiamine non-toxic. So is considered well-tolerated and safe.
Side effects are rare but can include skin rashes and eczema-like outbreaks at higher doses.
Sulbutiamine can also create mood swings. Particularly if you’re bipolar or are taking bipolar medication.
If you take Sulbutiamine late in the day you may find it interferes with sleep. Some find it has mild stimulant effects.
There are some reports that Sulbutiamine can be addictive. If you have addiction-like tendencies, you may want to be cautious about using this supplement. It does affect dopamine levels in the brain.
Available Forms
Sulbutiamine is sold in tablet, capsule and powder form. Tablets and capsules are usually 750 mg each.
It’s sold as a prescription medication in some countries under the brand names Arcalion, Enerion, Bisibuthiamine, and Youvitan.
In Dec. 2019, the FDA in the USA added Sulbutiamine to its “Dietary Supplement Ingredient Advisory List“. The FDA states that it, “does not necessarily indicate that the FDA has determined that the ingredient is unsafe; it means FDA is taking steps to further evaluate the ingredient.”
This means that you can no longer buy Sulbutiamine from vendors like Amazon or Bulk Supplements.
I’ve been getting my Sulbutiamine directly from Double Wood Supplements. The company is owned by Evan Wood and his wife and they sell high quality products.
So if you’re looking for another source for Sulbutiamine, I highly recommend going here: Double Wood Supplements – Sulbutiamine 50-capsules – 200 mg.
Nootropics Expert Recommendation
Sulbutiamine 400 mg to 1,000 mg per day
We recommend using Sulbutiamine as a nootropic supplement.
Your body does not make Sulbutiamine on its own. So to get its benefits you must take it as a supplement.
Sulbutiamine is especially helpful for those suffering from depression. Experience shows it helps stop and reverse the symptoms associated with depression. Likely because this nootropic helps boost the activity of dopamine, serotonin, GABA and glutamate in the brain.
Personally, I’ve found Sulbutiamine to be more effective (and safer) than any prescription anti-depressant I’ve ever tried.
Sulbutiamine is also particularly helpful to students and executives who want to boost cognition, learning and memory.
Sulbutiamine can produce a noticeable increase in mental clarity. And give you a significant energy boost physically and mentally. You’ll feel more awake and alert. Without the side effects you’d get from stimulants like caffeine.
Sulbutiamine also stacks very well with racetams like Piracetam and Aniracetam.
I recommend and use Double Wood Supplements – Sulbutiamine.
[i] Wernicke-Korsakoff syndrome. Medline Plus Medical Encyclopedianlm.nih.gov/medlineplus Retrieved April 7, 2016 (source)
[ii] Martin P.R., Singleton C.K., Hiller-Sturmhofel S. “The Role of Thiamine Deficiency in Alcoholic Brain Disease” National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism nih.gov Retrieved April 7, 2016 (source)
[iii] Singleton C.K., Martin P.R. “Molecular mechanisms of thiamine utilization.” Current Molecular Medicine 2001 May;1(2):197-207. (source)
[iv] Ollat H., Laurent B., Bakchine S., Michel B.F., Touchon J., Dubois B. “[Effects of the association of sulbutiamine with an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor in early stage and moderate Alzheimer disease]”. L’Encephale2007 Mar-Apr;33(2):211-5.
[v] Benton D., Griffiths R., Haller J. “Thiamine supplementation mood and cognitive functioning.” Psychopharmacology 1997 Jan;129(1):66-71. (source)
[vi] Tiev K.P., Cabane J., Imbert J.C. “[Treatment of chronic postinfectious fatigue: randomized double-blind study of two doses of sulbutiamine (400-600 mg/day) versus placebo].” La Revue de Medicine Interne 1999 Oct;20(10):912-8. (source)
[vii] Micheau J., Durkin T.P., Destrade C., Rolland Y, Jaffard R. “Chronic administration of sulbutiamine improves long term memory formation in mice: possible cholinergic mediation.” Pharmacology, Biochemistry and Behavior 1985 Aug;23(2):195-8. (source)
[viii] Bizot J.C., Herpin A., Pothion S., Pirot S., Trovero F., Ollat H. “Chronic treatment with sulbutiamine improves memory in an object recognition task and reduces some amnesic effects of dizocilpine in a spatial delayed-non-match-to-sample task.” Progress in Neuro-psychopharmacology & Biology Psychiatry. 2005 Jul;29(6):928-35. (source)
[ix] Sobolevsky T., Rodchenkov G. “Sulbutiamine in sports.” Drug Testing and Analysis 2010 Nov-Dec;2(11-12):643-6. (source)
[x] Dmitriev D.G., Gamidov S.I., Permiakova O.V. “[Clinical efficacy of the drug enerion in the treatment of patients with psychogenic (functional) erectile dysfunction].” Urology 2005 Jan-Feb;(1):32-5. (source)
I need the best motivation anti anxiety mood lifting combination for a 25 year old Male. He seems fine to people. Doctors, counselors, the psychologist all find him delightful. The psychologist says he has Peter pan syndrome and does t want to grow up.(the Male 25 yr old knows that’s not it) When it comes to doing.. the best way to describe him is “cant”. He just can’t and when he does he works way harder than he should have too for a portion of result. I think it’s one or more missing elements in his system. The looking into nootropics has struck a nerve with me. Now where do I start for quick results?
Lisa, it sounds like something is either low or out of balance. Motivation is governed by the AMPA receptor/dopamine/reward pathway in the brain. You can read more about that here for some ideas: https://nootropicsexpert.com/hacking-motivation-with-nootropics/
The challenge as you’ve found out is you haven’t the benefit of any kind of success with prescription drugs. So we can’t reverse engineer things. It’ll take some trial and error before you can isolate what the problem is. That takes experimenting and the willingness to experiment.
There are no “quick results” for something like this. No matter how we’ve been conditioned by mainstream medicine to expect a one-pill solution. It’s not the way life works. You can achieve profound results using nootropics but need to do the work to make it happen.
Some say too much thiamine causes cancer… What are your thoughts
Bev, I keep on asking this question. But where do you guys find this stuff? Please share. Because if it’s true then I’m closing down Nootropics Expert. Clearly I don’t know what I’m talking about.
Hello David, thank you for the article, it is an excellent read. I am 30 years old, studying to pass medical board exams and would like to start and continue using Sulbutiamine. The supplement is offered here as Arcalion in 200mg tablets. What do you recommend for dosing? Would I experience an effect with just using Arcalion alone? Thank you for your time!
Ashley, Alcalion is just a brand name for Sulbutiamine sold in some countries. Dosage would remain the same as described in this review. See the section above called “How does Sulbutiamine feel?” for the benefits that experienced users report.
Would this be enough for you? I can’t answer that because each of us has different requirements for cognitive enhancement. I suggest doing a search of Nootropics Expert (search function top right) and search for “studying”. And see what else turns up that may help you.
You’ll get the best results with a stack of several different supplements because there is no “one pill” solution. But Sulbutiamine is certainly one of those supplements.
Hi David,
My stack at the moment is composed of ALCAR, DHA, CHOLINE, mindlab pro and noopept. I would like to try subultamine to increase motivation. Would you think it will be too much?
Kind regards,
Peter
Peter, it’s certainly not “too much”. There’s no such thing. It takes what it takes until you get to where you want to be.
Aniracetam is a good choice for motivation because it activates AMPA receptors which in turn activate the dopamine/reward pathway which is responsible for motivation. And you’ll need to add L-Tyrosine as well to boost dopamine.
Here’s my bit on motivation: https://nootropicsexpert.com/hacking-motivation-with-nootropics/
Hey David. Im 21 yrs old. I’m wondering if taking “Uridine” or “sulbutiamine” will help heal my depression and ahedonia/apathy induced by some srris,prozac & zoloft & also antidepressants such as wellbutrin and gabapentin i took in the past. i am now currently 6 months without taking any meds. but take adaptogenic herbs & nootropics such as, gotu kola, brahmi, rhodiola, ginkgo biloba, NAC, DHA, lithium orotate, ALCAR, L-theanine,raw cacao, & turmeric daily.. some stuff i find helps, but only temporarily and the apathetic numb feelings come back, and the brain fog takes over. my memory isnt as sharp, i have a hard time coming up with words.. i was thinking of taking Noopept,Uridine,Lions mane, Nsi-189, black seed oil, and oatstraw. do you think any of those would help to heal my anhedonia & brain fog completely? i feel i have some sort of tbi and not sure what else to try. do you think caffeine will help me heal?. Thank you so much.
Gigi, this is the same response I gave you under the Uridine thread. And BTW, just one or two supplements like Uridine or Sulbutiamine will not do it. This will take time, a lot of trial and error, and a stack of nootropic supplements. Don’t be surprised if you end up using 5 – 10 different supplements to heal the damage and get your brain back in shape.
I did a bit for our email newsletter last year on anhedonia. Here’s a copy: https://mailchi.mp/ed0e21d51fbc/new-how-to-design-a-personal-nootropic-stack
The problem with SSRIs and SNRIs that you’re not told by your doctor, pharmacist or the drug company is the havoc they wreak on your brain. Including things like desensitizing receptors and synapses and changing gene expression. Recovering from these drugs is no different than someone recovering from traumatic brain injury.
You’ll need to take it a step at a time. And don’t expect that you’ll be able to quickly undo damage that took years to create. You have several options or approaches you can take. Treat the brain fog, try to improve memory, or go at it like it’s traumatic brain injury.
I did a lot of research not too long ago on brain fog because it kept coming up. Especially during personal consultations. I discovered that if you deal with the brain fog it often fixes everything else that is ailing your brain. You can find out how here: https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-supplements-for-brain-fog/
Hi David, with Sulbutiamine being added to the FDA’s ingredient advisory list in December it has become increasingly difficult to find.
What do you think is the next best option for similar effects? Benfotiamine? Pterostilbene? Or something else?
Just to clarify what I meant, would it take a blend of Benfotiamine, Pterostilbene, and perhaps noopept?
Just curious on your thoughts specifically to boost motivation.
Thanks in advance!
Blake, I just noticed today that the Sulbutiamine I normally get from Double Wood supplements was no longer available on Amazon. But you can still buy it directly from their website. And I know others still sell it directly. Like HR Supplements in Phoenix here: https://www.hrsupplements.com/sulbutiamine-capsules-200mg-60-count/?afmc=NOOTROPICS
I’ve tried other things and Sulbutiamine still works the best in my opinion.
Seems that Amazon is extremely shy of the FDA and they did the same thing with Vinpocetine. I love both nootropics and will go out of my way to track sources down. Amazon is not the only option. And it’s a good reminder too that Amazon is not our only source of supplements that help our brain.
Let’s do everything we can to keep it that way.
Can you recommend me the best website to buy sulbutiamine?
Also I want to know how I can buy ALCAR, CDP-choline, dha, NALT, PS, Bacopa monnieri, Rhodiola rosea, Pine bark extract, caffeine, L-theanine, alpha lipoic acid, CoQ10, PQQ, vinpocetine as a single ingredient. please tell me the URL of the website that you trust.
I have taken MLP and PL for 1 year and experienced some side effects like headache, dizziness, dry mouth, depression. So I want to find what is the problem and fix it. To find problemes, I will buy the single ingredients of MLP and PL and find what ingredients have bad effects for me. Please help me finding the best websites that sell the single ingredients of sulbutiamine, ALCAR, CDP-choline, dha, NALT, PS, Bacopa monnieri, Rhodiola rosea, Pine bark extract, caffeine, L-theanine, alpha lipoic acid, CoQ10, PQQ, vinpocetine.
Please delete the message below this. because I mistyped it duplicate content made.
Seungeon, wise move to separate the ingredients so you can determine what’s causing the problem. But easier said than done.
What country are you in?
Here in the USA all of the individual ingredients are easily found on Amazon or The Vitamin Shoppe. Except for Vinpocetine which is no longer available on Amazon. You need to buy this nootropic in the USA directly from Life Extension, NOW Foods or Swanson Vitamins.
Dear David
Thanks for the useful data, I would like to ask about the maximum duration to use it please
Thanks in advance
Peter Mitry
Peter, if you mean “maximum duration” in years I’ve been using Sulbutiamine every day for the last 12 years. And have no intention of stopping any time soon.
Would you lose any of the benefits taking it every day vs 5 days on/ 2 days off? If yes, which benefits would you lose due to tolerance and what ones would continue?
I’m mainly interested in taking it for depressive illness and energy levels. Thanks in advance.
David, I’ve not found tolerance to be a problem with Sulbutiamine. And have used it twice a day for years. But others report that tolerance can be a problem with Sulbutiamine. So when taking it for extended periods, you may find it beneficial to take it for 5 days, and take 2 days off before your next dose.
Hi David,
I am trying to build your recommended ADHD stack as a treatment for my ADHD and to maximise the positive benefits and minimise the bad from taking Vyvanse. I am worried about the damage long term use may be after just being diagnosed and prescribed the drug. I have issues with how mood/depression and so would like to add Sulbutiamine.
Do you think issues with tolerance for Sulbutiamine arise in the same way it can for ADHD prescription stimulants and that it could be the neuroprotective elements in the ADHD stack you take/recommend that keep that from happening for you? In the same way you it does for Ritalin?
I would prefer to not have to cycle anything and just keep it simple!
PS. Thank you so much for the information you have gathered and share here. I’m just beginning my journey with ADHD treatment at 37 and your research and personal experience is a huge help in treating myself and understanding nootropics and supplements that psychiatrists do not work with.
Natalie, tolerance should not be an issue with Sulbutiamine if you follow dosage guidelines. It’s just two thiamine molecules bonded together to help thiamine cross the blood-brain barrier.
The stack I describe in the above post is made to support stimulant use so you can avoid tolerance and prevent brain damage from long-term use. But you need to follow dosage recommendations and timing during the closely to make this work.
Aniracetam and Sulbutiamine are the only two ‘optional’ nootropics in this stack. I discovered that these two supplements combined helped depression that is often a side effect of ADHD. But this stack will work without these two supplements.
Hi David,
Could you give an explanation why would Sulbutiamine make me extremely sleepy, drowsy and no energy at all. no motivation? I take 400mg.
Dave, sounds like too much acetylcholine and/or GABA. Both of which thiamine helps to produce. Try cutting your dosage in half. If that doesn’t work then I’d consider eliminating Sulbutiamine from your stack.
I am going to try Sulbutiamine before bed.
Read all the comments
So you mentioned elsewhere you take a B Complex
In you stack you still add this B1 ?
I also asked on another about B1 from quinoa vs methylated. Might be good to have this here too answered.
Robert, I do use a B-Complex while using Sulbutiamine. Because of the benefits of this nootropic. And I do not have any faith in getting enough of the B-Vitamins from ‘natural sources’ like yeast because there is no way to tell how much of each vitamin I’m actually getting.
I have no way to prove this other than testing each food. But am certain that these foods are not providing the amounts of vitamins and minerals that we expect.
Do i need to stack alpha GPC with sulbutiamine?
Dave, you don’t need to use Alpha GPC when using Sulbutiamine. But this nootropic does contribute to the synthesis of acetylcholine. Adding Alpha GPC may provide even more benefit than using it on its own.
Hello , I have Parkinson’s disease and dr Constatini from Italy has some of us parkies using high dose thiamine hcl at 4000 mg or less a day to stop the progression . I did try a home made capsule (cleaner ) not sourced from China and no improvement or stopped any progression. Now about to give some from bulk supplements a try. Do you have any idea how this sulbutiamine might do the trick instead of the b-1 hcl ? You’re thoughts and experise on this matter would be very appreciated since I’m declining faster now and becoming sad and discouraged . Blessings , Carri
Carri, Sulbutiamine was developed in Japan because the population at that time was suffering from severe thiamine deficiency.
The problem is thiamine is not very bioavailable. And the reason why your Italian doctor recommends such high dosages.
Please try Sulbutiamine. Because it was designed to address exactly this problem. It provides the thiamine your body and brain need. And actually gets into cells to do the job.
I have read that sulbutiamine needs gluthatione to reduce to thiamine. I deal with major/severe CFS/ME and have been round and round for years trying to get better. One thing many CFS people have is low to no GSH, which is me. Would I be better off with injections of thiamine?
Susan, I really would like to know the motivation of people who come up with stuff like that. Because it’s NOT true.
Sulbutiamine is two thiamine molecules bonded together which makes it fat-soluble and can easily cross the blood-brain barrier. It’s the reason the Japanese invented this in the first place. Because thiamine on its own could not cross the blood-brain barrier.
Carri, please let us know how you are getting on with Sulbutiamine. I hope it is helping your condition.
Alan
I was severely B1 deficient in 2018/2019. Beware that not all B1’s are the same. The potency or effectiveness can be *massively* different even between brands with the same ingredient!
The strongest thiamine mononitrate (thiamine Hcl alternative used in multivitamins) I’ve tried is from BulkSupplements. When my B1 deficiency was worst, I tried several brands and this was most effective by far. Go slow, and work the dose up.
You also should try these alternative forms of thiamine. If you’re severely deficient thiamine mononitrate/hcl just won’t be enough, and you’ll need one or more of these too:
– Benfotiamine
– Allithiamine (TTFD) – can be used topically. Extremely effective, but can be hard on the gut.
– Cocarboxylase (Thiamine pyrophosphate) – best sublingual. I still use this form of B1 every day.
Always take thiamine with extra magnesium.
Also, work on improving your gut health. The human gut microbiota produces various B vitamins, including thiamine, for the host. The healthier your gut, the better.
Dr. Lonsdale is one of the top experts on thiamine deficiency in the US:
www (dot) hormonesmatter (dot) com/ttfd-thiamine-derivative/
Do you know any trustworthy online sellers of sulbutiamine?
Dave, I’ve been using this one by LongLifeNutri for the last few months and it works: https://amzn.to/32MDa3S
Hello 2nd attempt to receive 70 page download of secrets of optimized brain before buying the other book and scheduling and appointment for advice
thanks dmarko
Donna, what happened when you tried to download “Secrets”?
Hi
Is Sulbutiamine and Benfotiamine the same?
Meng, not they are not.
Sulbutiamine is a synthetic derivative of Thiamine made by bonding two thiamine molecules together which increases bioavailability. And Benfotiamine is a S-acyl derivative of thiamine which also increases bioavailability but is a different chemical structure.
I’m becoming less motivated lately and I’m thinking of taking sulbutiamine,how safe is it to take are there any side effects
Kenneth, “Side Effects” and safety notes for Sulbutiamine are right above this comments section.
If this is fat soluble, does it reach a point where you can have too much in your system since the body cannot excrete it as easily as water soluble thiamine?
Frank, great question and I suppose using too much for too long could pose problems. But I’ve been using 400 mg twice a day for 10 years and haven’t had any issues.
I’ve just purchased sulbutiamine from bulk supplements – powdered, and the taste is absolutely vile and recommendations on how to take it/what to mix it in?
Ray get a capsule machine and make capsules. They only cost $20 – 25.
is Sulbutiamine still available at bulk supps?
Susan, the FDA put Sulbutiamine in their “advisory list” and told supplement companies not to sell it. This almost always happens when some Big Pharma company decides something is so good they want to sell it as a drug.
You can no longer buy Sulbutiamine on Amazon and Bulk Supplements no longer stocks it. The only company I trust that still sells it is: https://doublewoodsupplements.com/products/sulbutiamine
Hi David,
I recently saw your video on Thiamine/Sulbutiamine. Since my hernia surgery a year ago, I lost weight and energy plus developed anxiety but have slowly been recovery my weight and energy back but the anxiety has stayed with me over this year right up to the present time. I am age 71 and over the years have experienced hypoglycemia which I treated very well with Licorice Root powder. But this is not helping me since the surgery. I am very healthy and do not have any other health problems. Most of my life I have been eating organic natural foods and have had plenty of energy and it all changed a year ago after the surgery. I understand that surgery can deplete many minerals and vitamins in the body and can take many months to recover. I would appreciate any advice you can offer. I feel there is something missing and it might be B1 which I have been taking without any results. Thank you, Dennis
Dennis, it could be B1 and it wouldn’t hurt to try Sulbutiamine because it is very effective in raising thiamine levels in your system. I also suggest you try a good nature-identical multi like the Performance Lab Multi which I reviews. It has nothing other than biologically active vitamins and minerals that your body need.
Also, take a look at this post I wrote on anxiety as it may give you some ideas: https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-nootropics-for-social-anxiety/
I wanted to know your opinion on this David.
I’m planning to try your natural nootropic stack to treat ADD which is Aniracetam, Sulbutiamine, Mind Lab Pro and unrefined coconut oil what do you think? Is there anything else that I can add to improve the stack or is this enough? For now I have the mind lab pro. I still need to buy the others to complete. I would greatly appreciate your opinion David.
Kyle, if it’s truly ADD then you’ll need more than Aniracetam, Sulbutiamine, Mind Lab Pro and unrefined coconut oil. Please see my post on ADD for the stack I developed and have been using for the last 12 years: https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-nootropics-for-adhd-add/
It’s just my opinion that I’m ADD I don’t have a Ritalin neither an Adderal or even consulted any doctor about my symptoms. I don’t really like to see a doctor here in Philippines about this matter I don’t trust them for some reasons. What stack should I take? Should I follow the stack you took for 12 years without any ADD medications? My decision is going with the stack that you mentioned above. I behave like I’m ADD for sure I resonate completely while reading this article.
Kyle, I did an experiment a couple of years ago. For the first time since I started on Ritalin, I quit using the stimulant and used only the nootropic stack I describe in my ADHD post. I used ONLY this stack for an entire year and my Adult ADD symptoms were under control.
I know for sure that I could have continued using only this stack and stayed off the prescription stimulants. But I made a decision after a year that my work load was such that I needed the extra push that I could get from Ritalin.
I tell you this story only to emphasize that you should be able to control your ADD symptoms by using only the nootropic stack described here > https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-nootropics-for-adhd-add/
I suffer from a giant lack of motivation / procrastination. And anxiety is my baseline emotion. In an effort to solve this short-term I tried both Sulbutiamine and Phenyl Racetam. Even both together. At various dosages.
What does it mean if these substances don’t do anything at all for me? Is it because of my Asperger diagnose? I feel like the lack of effect is a key to something.
Wilfried, are you dosing Sulbutiamine and Phenylpiracetam correctly? Sulbutiamine is fat-soluble and requires a health fat to make it into cells. And Phenylpiracetam, like other racetams needs to be stacked with a choline supplement like Alpha GPC or CDP-Choline.
I recommend reading my post on how motivation works here > https://nootropicsexpert.com/hacking-motivation-with-nootropics/. And consider trying to boost dopamine as well to see if that helps. You could try L-Tyrosine or NALT.
And for taming anxiety, see my post here > https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-nootropics-for-social-anxiety/
Dealing with Asperger’s is likely contributing and presents more of a challenge because from what I’ve seen, this syndrome could be a problem with brain connectivity. If this is the case then some nootropics may not work as well because of brain cell signalling problems. And this type of thing is way above my level of expertise. All I can offer is to help point you in the right direction so you can do more research on your own.
Hi David,
Why do you recommend such a high dosage of Sulbutiamine? I am playing around with a wide range of dosages to figure out what works best for me. But I can’t decide if I want to stick with a dosage well beyond what other sites recommend. Also, I am trying to determine which brand to buy from next. The dosage I take per serving is going to be a factor as well. Ideally, I could take this 3x/day, but a still pack a punch each time. I have been liking 600mg 3x/day (would buy Absorb Health’s 500mg caps next), but your site is the only one that recommends 1500mg/day. Others seem to most often say 600mg/day is the maximum dosage per day.
Thanks,
Adam
Adam, thank you for pointing this out and I’ve since corrected this. Dosage recommendations for Sulbutiamine are 400 mg to 1,000 mg per day. And for some bizarre reason the Nootropics Expert Recommendation was mistakenly saying 1,500 mg per day. Which clearly did not match the Dosage recommendations section and was not my intention.
No idea how this happened and I take full responsibility for this error. I personally find that 500 mg 2-times per day works great for me. Others may find smaller doses work just as well for them. The only way to find out is trial and error.
My apologies for this typo and thanks to you for bringing it to my intention. I love it when you guys keep me in check.
Thanks for the clarification. I was stumped for a couple of days trying to find another source backing up your recommendation haha. I am going to go back down to 400 mg twice daily for now while I have 200 mg caps.
I’ll be sure not to hesitate before commenting next time I question something you post. I guess it just shows how much I respect your expertise.
I appreciate it Adam. I don’t do it often enough but I like to remind people to verify everything you read on the World Wide Web. Including this website. None of us are perfect (please don’t tell my wife!) but nootropics can certainly help us get closer.
David,
I am a 78 year young active retired man that developed a neurotrophic condition in my feet that is annoying more that disabling. This developed because of a blood sugar issue that I have corrected and under control. I do not have type 2 blood sugar problems and returned my HgA1C under 5.4 for the past 6 months. However the lingering pain in the feet have lessened and very manageable but annoying.
I recently learned about a nootropic product called Lions Mane and its effect on the healing of nerve tissues in the brain and spinal areas. Is there any studies that are showing how this nutritional product might have a positive effect on conditions reflective of my foot nerve issues? Can you suggest any other product that might have a beneficial effect on this type of nerve issue? I m a very active young 78 old that walks and exercises a lot, in addition to have always taken natural nutritional supplements for years. My wife had a health food nutritional business for years. She was an instructor in student nursing program and taught pharmacology for years before passing of a liver cancer.
Any light you can shed on this condition would be greatly appreciated. I enjoy your YouTube videos on nootropics and follow many ideas I glean from your tropics. Thank you in advance.
Respectfully,
Larry Niswander
Larry, if this is truly neuropathic pain then Lion’s Mane may be a good choice. One study in Japan showed Lion’s Mane regenerated severely damaged gluteal nerves in rats. Who went from incapacitated to walking again.
I suggest doing a search on Nootropics Expert using the search bar top right for the keywords “nerve growth factor”, “nerve pain” etc. and see what comes up.
I know that Alpha Lipoic Acid and CBD Oil both have been shown effective in taming nerve pain as well.
“a neurotrophic condition in my feet that is annoying more that disabling”
This is the #1 symptom of thiamine deficiency. With low thiamine, you may experience nerve tingling and numbness in your legs and hands, and “foot drop”. I would try boosting your thiamine levels using thiamine hcl, thiamine mononitrate, benfotiamine, TTFD/allithiamine, and/or sublingual active B1 (cocarboxylase) and for a few months (along with topical or oral magnesium) and see if the problem goes down.
If it’s a thiamine deficiency it can take 1-2 years to heal, but if you catch it soon you can heal it.
very good, thanks David.
David: Now that im out of sertraline im very interested in Sulbutiamine, if this may be the strong tool for my depression syntoms (of course with other esential nootropic suplements like aniracetam that in fact my experience tell me works good, but i need something more; rodhiola, bacopa, (i didnt experience this two) etc., But with this sulbutiamine i dont want another adicction-dependence simmilar to sertraline; unless of course, that this sulbutiamine become absolutely necessary and less harmful than sertraline (ssri). Of course im taking DHA, MAGNESIUM, Lions Mane, acetyl carnitine, l theanine, some times l cystheine, b12 (vitamin), etc., etc., But im wondering about the more important and strong suplement nootropic for my sertraline substitution and anti-anxiety and depression, i think may be its between aniracetam, rohdiola, bacopa, and sulbutiamine. I was thinking also in st john wort, …what do you think? but not in 5htp, becouse i didnt have a good experience with this one. thanks in advance.
Francisco, you are on the right track here. And St. John’s wort may be a good option for you. But please closely read the side effects and dosage recommendations for this nootropic.
And you’ll have more success using a racetam like Aniracetam by stacking it with a good choline supplement like Alpha GPC or CDP-Choline and a tablespoon of unrefined coconut oil.
Would sulbutiamine work if 50mg thiamine mononitrate did not work so well? Thanks.
John, the only way to find out it to try it. Japanese scientists developed Sulbutiamine because regular thiamine didn’t work well enough to treat a deficiency.
Hi David, would you be able to comment on the differences between sulbutiamine and allithiamine? They both seem to be enhanced forms of thiamine that cross the BBB. Thanks.
Doug, allithiamine was originally discovered in and extracted from garlic. Sulbutiamine is synthesized in the lab. Both seem to do the job of thiamine once it crosses the blood-brain barrier. Like most other nootropics I imagine one will work better than the other depending on the person and their unique chemistry. I have not tried benfothiamine or allithiamine so please let me know how they work if you or anyone else reading this thread uses them.
my experience from 0 to 1mg of B1, life changing. it goes from struggling to read half a page to reading the whole afternoon.
my experience with sulbutiamin, or benfothiamine while being on vitamin B1 (for a long time), disapointing
may I suggest the logical upgrade of B1 is adding alpha lipoic acid, or chromium chelavite, the best form of chromium I know
Xaa, sounds like sound advice to me. Chromium combined with D-Phenylalanine activates AMPK. When activated, AMPK activates glycolysis and fatty acid oxidation to boost ATP production: https://nootropicsexpert.com/13-minerals-essential-for-the-optimized-brain/#chromium.
And Alpha Lipoic Acid boosts the production of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. And even increases glucose uptake in brain cells. Providing you with a boost of mental energy: https://nootropicsexpert.com/alpha-lipoic-acid/.
Hello David,
Still on the quest here. I would like to know what brand of Sulbutiamine do you use. There seem to be conflicting reviews of some brands online. I also would like to know why you use both Sulbutiamine & Aniracetam. Looks like they have same benefit.
Thanks
James, they compliment each other but to not have the same mechanism of action in your brain. Aniracetam of course is a racetam synthesized in the lab. It’s an “ampakine” nootropic which means it desensitizes AMPA receptors which increases the effectiveness of glutamate in your brain. Improving focus and concentration. And it releases more acetylcholine.
But Sulbutiamine is a derivative of Vitamin B1 (thiamine) which is required for the synthesis of acetylcholine (ACh). So there is more ACh available for Aniracetam to release.
Dig into the reviews of each here on Nootropics Expert to you have a deeper understanding on how these two work. Particularly the section “how it works in the brain” for each. I personally find the combination does help improve concentration and focus. And is a helluva antidepressant.
The last order of Sulbutiamine I got from Nootropics Depot. I know they test their product and find everything I’ve tried from them have been of high quality.
Donyou need thiamine in a addition of sulbutiamine?
John, you do not require additional thiamine if you are using Sulbutiamine. This version of thiamine is more bioavailable which is the reason why it was developed.