when to take choline bitartrate

Advanced Guide to Choline in Nootropic Stacks

David Tomen
Author:
David Tomen
11 minute read

best form of choline supplement

Choline is often the center of a great nootropic stack. Because without adequate levels of choline in your brain, the rest of your stack is unlikely to work very well.

Choline is neither a vitamin or mineral.  It is a water-soluble “nutrient” related to the B-Vitamin group. Choline was recognized as an “essential” nutrient by the US Institute of Medicine in 1998.[i]  “Essential” because your body cannot make enough choline on its own. You need to get it from food, or a supplement.

Choline is found naturally in eggs, liver, beef, salmon, cauliflower, Brussels sprouts and breast milk. Eggs are often considered “brain food” because they supply high amounts of choline.

Choline is needed by your body for liver function, normal brain function and development, nerve function, muscle movement, cellular energy and metabolism.

Choline assists in methylation involved in genetic expression and the repair of DNA, nerve signaling, and detoxification.

Your brain has a huge appetite for choline. It is critical for the synthesis of the key neurotransmitter acetylcholine. Which your brain uses to maintain clear communication between its billions of neurons.

In fact, choline is so vital to cognition and nerve function that, without it, we couldn’t move, think, sleep or remember anything.

Choline and acetylcholine are needed for the basics of attention, focus, memory, mood, thinking, and sleep.

Not enough choline and you deal with poor recall, memory loss, fatigue, brain fog, inability to learn, feeling irritable or distracted, and difficulty walking or staying balanced.

Stacking Racetams with Choline

If you use any of the racetam-family of nootropics in your stack, you likely should add a choline supplement. Because the racetams all affect choline and/or acetylcholine use in your brain in some way.

  • Aniracetam – releases more acetylcholine (ACh)
  • Coluracetam – increases choline – ACh conversion through the High Affinity Choline Uptake (HACU) process
  • Noopept – modulates ACh transmission
  • Oxiracetam – enhances choline-acetyltransferase (ChAT) which is used to synthesize acetylcholine
  • Piracetam – potentiates the flow of, and increases the effect of ACh
  • Phenylpiracetam – increases the density of ACh receptors
  • Pramiracetam – increases choline – ACh conversion through the High Affinity Choline Uptake (HACU) process
  • Nefiracetam – potentiates nicotinic acetylcholine receptors

I’ll dive into more detail on how each of the racetams affect acetylcholine in your brain in the post on acetylcholine. For now, you should know that when a racetam affects ACh in some way, it usually means you need to make sure more ACh is available. Or the racetam will not be as effective.choline bitartrate vs phosphatidylcholine

The other primary issue facing neurohackers are racetam-headaches. These headaches are unique because they usually only happen in a part of your brain. You’ll get to recognize them for what they are with more experience.

Racetam-headaches are caused by using a racetam without enough supplemental choline. Your brain is telling you it’s starved for choline.

Who Needs Choline

Even if you’re not interested in nootropics or brain optimization, anyone over 45 years can benefit from a good choline supplement. You’ll experience more alertness, energy, faster recall and better memory.

We all need choline for clarity and mental energy. And we have several nootropic supplements to choose from to boost choline in the brain. And increase the synthesis of acetylcholine.

We’ll review the best nootropics for boosting choline in your brain next.

CDP Choline and Alpha GPC together

Best Forms of Choline Supplements

Alpha GPC

Alpha GPC (L-Alpha Glycerylphosphorylcholine) is a choline source derived from soy or sunflower lecithin. This highly bioavailable form of choline quickly enters your brain.

As a nootropic supplement, Alpha GPC is about 40% choline by weight.

Alpha GPC naturally occurs in your brain as a byproduct of phosphatidylcholine (PC). When your brain needs more choline, and choline floating around in your brain is running low, it breaks down PC from cell membranes. And turns it into Alpha GPC.

The combination of the omega-3 fatty acid DHAAlpha GPC, and phosphatidylserine (PS) is used to form brain cell membranes.[ii]

And like other choline supplements, Alpha GPC provides the choline needed to synthesize acetylcholine.

But Alpha GPC is unique from other forms of choline. It helps increase human growth hormone.[iii] It restores and boosts nerve growth factor receptors in the brain.[iv] And stimulates the release of dopamine.[v]

One study in particular demonstrated why Alpha GPC is a favorite among neurohackers. 32 healthy volunteers received either Alpha GPC or a placebo.  Ten days later they were injected with scopolamine to induce amnesia. The researchers found Alpha GPC was able to prevent the impairment of attention and memory normally caused by scopolamine.[vi]

The researchers showed that memory function in healthy young people could be boosted simply by taking Alpha GPC as a nootropic supplement.

But a very recent study published in 2021 conducted with more than 12 million individuals aged 50 years or older who used Alpha GPC for at least 10 years had a 46% increased chance of stroke. So for short-term use Alpha GPC is safe. But if you need a choline supplement for long-term use you may want to consider switching to CDP-Choline (Citicoline) like I did once I read that study.

Choline Bitartrate

Choline Bitartrate is choline combined with tartaric acid to increase bioavailability. One of the least expensive forms of choline, it’s about 40% choline by weight.

Like other choline supplements, Choline Bitartrate provides the choline needed for acetylcholine synthesis. But neurohackers have found this form is not nearly as effective as other forms of choline.

However, if Choline Bitartrate is the only choline supplement you have available, we do have the science to prove it works as a nootropic.

A research team in the Netherlands gave 28 volunteers 2 grams of Choline Bitartrate or a placebo. An hour and 10 minutes after taking the supplements, they had participants attempt to hit the center of a target.

The volunteers who used the choline supplement were not only more accurate at hitting the target center than the placebo group. The also did it faster.

The researchers concluded there was a “choline-induced bias” towards precision, speed and accuracy.[vii] Now logic tells us that you’d have this positive outcome with any choline supplement. So if all you have to take is Choline Bitartrate – you’ll be OK.

Choline Citrate

Choline Citrate is choline combined with citrate which is an ester of citric acid. Citrate is involved in the transport mechanism of acetyl units from its site of synthesis in mitochondria to the site of acetylcholine synthesis.[viii]

And citrate plays another important role in the brain. Citrate is an intermediate in the Krebs cycle (also known as the TCA cycle or Tricarboxylic Acid cycle, or Citric acid cycle).

Citrate synthase catalyzes the condensation of oxaloacetate with acetyl CoA to form citrate. Citrate then acts as the substrate for aconitase and is converted in aconitic acid. This cycle ends with the regeneration of oxaloacetate.

This series of chemical reactions is the source of 2/3’s of the energy we get from food. Most of the energy made available by these steps is transferred to form NADH. Which then drives adenosine triphosphate (ATP) synthesis that fuels mitochondria and provides the energy needed for brain cells.[ix]

One of the less expensive versions of choline, Choline Citrate is about 50% choline by weight. And like other sources of choline, provides the raw material needed to synthesize acetylcholine.

Acetylcholine is the neurotransmitter needed to signal muscle movement.[x] But Choline Citrate is unique because it helps prevent fatigue, muscle aches and pain following a workout.best choline source reddit

I have personal experience with the benefits of Choline Citrate. For years, I saw a rheumatologist who injected cortisone into my shoulder muscles to relieve excruciating pain. Once I began supplementing with 3 – 4 grams of Choline Citrate per day, the severe muscle pain in my shoulders was gone.

So Choline Citrate provides the double benefit of improving concentration, energy levels, focus and memory. Along with less muscle pain and faster recovery after a workout.

CDP-Choline (Citicoline)

CDP-Choline (Cytidine Diphosphate Choline or cytidine 5′-diphosphocholine) is also known as Citicoline. This naturally occurring choline source is present in every cell in your body.

The CDP-Choline supplement is unique as a choline source. Once it’s digested it separates into cytidine and choline. When it gets to your brain it converts back to CDP-Choline.

Choline is needed for the synthesis of acetylcholine. And cytidine is a component of Ribonucleic acid (RNA). This molecule is involved in coding, decoding, regulation and the expression of genes. And once it gets into the brain, it converts to uridine.

When choline is in short supply, neuronal signaling resorts to grabbing choline molecules from phosphatidylcholine (PC) in cell membranes. This is where uridine steps in. Uridine is used to synthesize phosphatidylcholine (PC). Supplemental CDP-Choline provides the uridine needed for this synthesis. Which means that CDP-Choline helps repair those same cell membranes. To maintain neuron integrity.[xi]

CDP-Choline is only about 18% choline by weight. But it packs a punch when it comes to brain optimization. And is a favorite nootropic stack addition with many experienced neurohackers.

CDP-Choline vs Alpha GPC

When it comes to choosing between CDP-Choline or Alpha GPC for your nootropic stack. There really is no contest. These two choline supplements work well together.

The synthesis of acetylcholine (ACh) is largely dependent on the choline provided by phosphatidylcholine (PC).

Alpha GPC is a byproduct of phosphatidylcholine (PC). And supplemental CDP-Choline provides the uridine needed for PC synthesis.

So taken together, you provide your brain with the type of choline it needs right down at the cellular level.

Combining CDP-Choline together with Alpha GPC
 is a winning combination for any nootropic stack.

when to take choline bitartrate

Side Effects of Choline

Choline is considered safe and non-toxic. Small amounts are made in your body. And it is an “essential” nutrient.

But too much choline, like all nutrients and supplements, can become toxic if too much is taken. Or your body does not need supplemental choline.

My wife is a classic example. This stunningly beautiful, charming, intelligent women turns into the Wicked Witch From the West if she takes a choline supplement.

Like any nootropic used for brain optimization, neurotransmitter balance is key. Excess acetylcholine will depress levels of dopamine, norepinephrine and serotonin.

Serotonin and acetylcholine have an inverse relationship in your brain. In other words, as one goes up, the other goes down. So taking too much of a choline supplement can boost ACh too much. And force serotonin levels to drop.

Symptoms of too much choline or acetylcholine can include:

  • Irritability or anger
  • Anxiety and/or depression
  • Fatigue or feeling overly sleepy
  • Trouble concentrating, brain fog, lack of focus
  • Mental confusion or fatigue
  • Decreased motivation
  • Negativity, pessimism, rumination
  • Poor memory
  • Problems understanding or performing tasks
  • Feelings of helplessness or hopelessness
  • Diarrhea, constipation, gas, bloating, nausea, vomiting, dizziness
  • Muscle weakness
  • Tingling or numbness in the arms or legs
  • Joint pain, discomfort or swelling[xii]

Nootropics Expert Recommendation

Every one of us needs choline to function. Choline is an essential nootropic supplement for anyone whose goal is brain optimization.

Choline is needed to synthesize acetylcholine (ACh). We need choline for cell-membrane signaling (phospholipids), lipid transport (lipoproteins), and methyl-group metabolism (homocysteine reduction).[xiii]

We need choline to provide the acetylcholine affected by any of the racetam-family of nootropics.

Your brain will start to literally consume itself to get the building blocks it needs to make acetylcholine. If you don’t provide it with enough choline.

My favorite choline supplements after years of trial and error are CDP-Choline (Citicoline) and Alpha GPC. If I’ve got muscle pain, I’ll take Choline Citrate for a few days. Until the pain goes away.

I use 500 mg of Cognizin™ (branded form of citicoline) per day in my nootropic stack. Cognizin is included in the double-dose of Mind Lab Pro I use every day.

Whenever I feel a racetam-headache coming on I’ll take 500 mg of Alpha GPC. And the headache is gone within 15 minutes.

Your Mileage May Vary. Each of us has a unique body and brain. So what works for me may not work as well for you. Listen to your body and give your brain the choline it needs.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. This post may also contain other affiliate links and I will be compensated if you make a purchase after clicking on my links.

[i] Zeisel S.H., da Costa K.A. “Choline: an essential nutrient for public health.” Nutrition Reviews. 2009 Nov;67(11):615-23. (source)

[ii] Kidd P.M. “Neurodegeneration from mitochondrial insufficiency: nutrients, stem cells, growth factors, and prospects for brain rebuilding using integrative management.” Alternative Medicine Revue. 2005 Dec;10(4):268-93. (source)

[iii] Ceda G.P., Ceresini G., Denti L., Magnani D., Marchini L, Valenti G., Hoffman A.R. “Effects of cytidine 5′-diphosphocholine administration on basal and growth hormone-releasing hormone-induced growth hormone secretion in elderly subjects.” Acta Endocrinologica (Copenhagen).1991;124(5):516-20. (source)

[iv] Vega J.A., Cavallotti C., del Valle M.E., Mancini M., Amenta F. “Nerve growth factor receptor immunoreactivity in the cerebellar cortex of aged rats: effect of choline alfoscerate treatment.” Mechanisms of Ageing and Development 1993 Jun;69(1-2):119-27. (source)

[v] Trabucchi M., Govoni S., Battaini F.  “Changes in the interaction between CNS cholinergic and dopaminergic neurons induced by L-alpha-glycerylphosphorylcholine, a cholinomimetic drug.” Farmaco Sci.1986 Apr;41(4):325-34. (source)

[vi] Canal N., Franceschi M., Alberoni M., Castiglioni C., De Moliner P., Longoni A. “Effect of L-alpha-glyceryl-phosphorylcholine on amnesia caused by scopolamine.” International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology, Therapy, Toxicology. 1991 Mar;29(3):103-7. (source)

[vii] Naber M., Hommel B., Colzato L.S. “Improved human visuomotor performance and pupil constriction after choline supplementation in a placebo-controlled double-blind study.” Scientific Reports 2015 Aug 14;5:13188. (source)

[viii] Sterling G.H., O’Neill J.J. “Citrate as the precursor of acetyl moiety of acetylcholine” Journal of Neurochemistry 31(2):525-30 · September 1978 (source)

[ix] Ebenhöh O., Heinrich R. “Evolutionary optimization of metabolic pathways. Theoretical reconstruction of the stoichiometry of ATP and NADH producing systems.” Bulletin of Mathematical Biology. 2001 Jan;63(1):21-55. (source)

[x] Sanders L.M., Zeisel S.H. Choline – Dietary Requirements and Role in Brain Development Nutrition Today 2007; 42(4): 181–186. (source)

[xi] Wang L., Pooler A.M., Albrecht M.A., Wurtman R.J. “Dietary uridine-5′-monophosphate supplementation increases potassium-evoked dopamine release and promotes neurite outgrowth in aged rats.” Journal of Molecular Neuroscience 2005;27(1):137-45. (source)

[xii] Overstreet D.H., Janowsky D.S. “The Role of Acetylcholine Mechanisms in Affective Disorders” American College of Neuropsychopharmacology (source)

[xiii] Penry J, Manore M. ‘Choline: an important micronutirent for maximal endurance-exercise performance?’  International Journal of Sports Nutrition, Exercise and Metabolism. 2008;18:191–203. (source)

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Join The Discussion - 99 comments

Tamer Alfrehat
January 14, 2021

hi David
i think that i have have too much choline or acetylcholine whatever i take like (mind lab pro,ginseng, ALCAR, B complex,Bacopa,CDP choline…..etc) i will have all symptoms and side effects of too much choline or acytelcholine.
the problem is most of the effective nootropics will increase the ACH.
i am very lost, what i should do to control it and regulate the choline and ACH.

regarding the leaky gut and brain i have to use all the nootropics that you mentioned or some of them???

what you think about Forskolin, l carnosine and l glutamine????
i would like to add it to my stock
mind lab pro
panax gensing
l tyrosine and sometimes NALT
l tryptophan
NALCAR
Ubiquinol (Kaneka Ubiquinol)
DHA
krill oil
Magtein
glycine
Pycnogenol
B complex
D3 k2
v c
collagen
whey protein
selenium,iodine,copper,zinc
i was using NAC but it effect on my kidneys but it was the best and do workout every day.
so after i tried alot’s of nootropics and i didn’t succes that means too much ACH or choine or it’s leaky gut and brain what ever i take as a nootropic i feel so bad and sleepy because of that i take all my nootropics before sleep exacept l tyrosine.

can you please provide me the link of your book head first
GOD BLESS YOU MR.DAVID and lot’s of appreciation and regards

    David Tomen
    January 14, 2021

    Tamer, you can get a copy of Head First here: https://nootropicsexpert.com/store/

    Out of the 3 you mentioned I’d suggest L-Glutamine because it also helps heal a leaky brain and leaky gut. As well as Curcumin and one that still need to be added to that list: Quercetin: https://nootropicsexpert.com/quercetin/. You’re already using the B-Complex vitamins, DHA and magnesium which all help a leaky gut.

    And looking at your stack I don’t see how/where you are getting too much acetylcholine from. And most of your list I suggest using during the day rather than before bed. Any particular reason why you are taking these before bed?

      Tamer Alfrehat
      January 18, 2021

      Because I feel irritability, anxiety, depression, fatigue, drowsiness, difficulty concentrating, brain fog, lack of focus, mental confusion, low motivation, negativity, pessimism, memory problems in understanding or performing tasks, helplessness and despair, constipation, dizziness and muscle weakness, and for this reason I take a nootropic before bed and then sleep without suffering .
      Today I tried to get a nootropic during the day, felt everything I mention above and just wanted my day to end.
      Regarding the head first book, I opened the link that sent it to me but can’t find a way to continue, it just gives me the box that goes to the secrets of the optimized brain.
      Thank you, Mr. David, for all your support and response,
      God bless you

        David Tomen
        January 18, 2021

        Tamer, still working on the shopping cart issue for Head First. I hope to have that fixed before the day it done in this part of the world.

        The symptoms you detail in your comment can be caused by a host of things. Including a messed up microbiome. What is your diet like? What foods do you eat?

        Tamer Alfrehat
        January 20, 2021

        It’s a 99% microbiome issue because I feel bloated after eating meals and in the morning I feel very constipated, I have tried betanine hcl and organic apple cider viniger has helped me but it lowers blood pressure so I can’t take it during the day.
        And I use a combination of probiotics,prebiotics and a digestive enzyme but it doesn’t always help me that’s why i was asking you about leaky gut and brain, and I went to the doctor, he said everything in your head – I can’t see any medical problem except for very high ldl because you follow a healthy ketogenic lifestyle regimen.
        And I eat very clean, non-GMO and gluten-free food, sometimes organic but not always organic I eat (all kinds of cruciferous vegetables, leafy greens, peas, meat, beef liver and animal organs, pasture eggs, raw nuts, dark cocoa powder, avocados, Tahini, Organic Extra Virgin Coconut Oil, Extra Virgin Cold-Pressed Olive Oil, resistance-Carb Like A Small Sweet Potato After A Workout.
        And eat berries in general, but in moderation.
        I avoid animal fats, milk and even all dairy as well, refined carbohydrates, bad sunflower oil, corn and soybeans,….vegetable oils in general.
        But I am still not sure whether this is a healthy diet lifestyle or not, I just followed it more than 1 year because I need to fix my health problem not for weight loss goal, I am very fit.
        I think ketogenic diet is good and helped me but was not that much effective or i’m doing something wrong, and I was doing intermittent fasting before but not anymore.

        David Tomen
        January 21, 2021

        Tamer, no matter how good your diet chances are you are still missing some key nutrients. Which is why I recommend a high quality Multi needs to be used daily.

        I would stay on the “leaky gut” idea for a while. Because from the symptoms you describe is makes sense. I would also add Quercetin to this stack because it has the unique ability to raise levels of Claudin-4 which is need to heal a leaky gut.

    Tamer Alfrehat
    January 20, 2021

    It’s a 99% microbiome issue because I feel bloated after eating meals and in the morning I feel very constipated, I have tried betanine hcl and organic apple cider viniger has helped me but it lowers blood pressure so I can’t take it during the day.
    And I use a combination of probiotics,prebiotics and a digestive enzyme but it doesn’t always help me that’s why i was asking you about leaky gut and brain, and I went to the doctor, he said everything in your head – I can’t see any medical problem except for very high ldl because you follow a healthy ketogenic lifestyle regimen.
    And I eat very clean, non-GMO and gluten-free food, sometimes organic but not always organic I eat (all kinds of cruciferous vegetables, leafy greens, peas, meat, beef liver and animal organs, pasture eggs, raw nuts, dark cocoa powder, avocados, Tahini, Organic Extra Virgin Coconut Oil, Extra Virgin Cold-Pressed Olive Oil, resistance-Carb Like A Small Sweet Potato After A Workout.
    And eat berries in general, but in moderation.
    I avoid animal fats, milk and even all dairy as well, refined carbohydrates, bad sunflower oil, corn and soybeans,….vegetable oils in general.
    But I am still not sure whether this is a healthy diet lifestyle or not, I just followed it more than 1 year because I need to fix my health problem not for weight loss goal, I am very fit.
    I think ketogenic diet is good and helped me but was not that much effective or i’m doing something wrong, and I was doing intermittent fasting before but not anymore.

      David Tomen
      January 21, 2021

      Tamer, no matter how “good” your diet chances are you are still missing some key nutrients. And why a high quality Multi is needed to make up for what you are not getting from food.

      A “very high LDL” is not good but I’m no expert on bringing it down. That is something worth checking out and finding out how to lower it.

      And stay on the “leaky gut” idea because there very well could be something there as well. Doctor’s say things like that because they don’t know. And if my doctor said it I’d fire him/her.

      Check out my review on Quercetin because it has the unique ability to boost Claudin-4 which is key in healing a leaky gut/leaky brain.

        Tamer Alfrehat
        February 23, 2021

        Mr. David Thank you very much for all of your support.
        I followed your instructions, and just as you expected I had a leaky gut and leaky brain and I thought you were right.
        When I add quercetin / curcumin and glutamine , everything starts to improve day by day and I saw one review talking about the missing link for motivation, then I add resveratrol and Rhodiola rosa and I get a much better good result.
        My first concern about quercetin is using it for only 12 weeks then what do you recommend should i stop take it???
        and how long should I work for a brain leak ????
        What nootropic should I cycle ????
        Here’s my new list of nootropics because I’ve stopped using Panax Ginseng, Maca, Pycnogenol … and many more.
        My list is:
        MLP 2 tab morning and afternoon
        coq10 200 mg pre-workout with coconut oil and 200 mg ubiquinol afternoon with food
        dha 1000mg morning and afternoon
        L-Glutamine 5 gm before and after exercise
        L tyrosine 500 mg morning and afternoon 500 mg
        Resveratrol 200mg in the morning before a workout
        Taurine 1000 mg Morning before Workout
        B-complex 1 tab morning
        Rhodiola Rosea 500 mg Afternoon
        Glycine 1 teaspoon 3 grams at night
        Magnesium 400 mg before bed
        trptophan 500mg before bed
        Curcumin 750 mg 3 times a day
        Vinpocetine 30 mg daily
        Quercetin with bromelain 800 mg daily
        D3 5000iu + k2
        vc 1000mg
        Milk thistle and dandelion root
        I still haven’t reached my goal for the brain, but I’m much better than before. Can I add any other nootropics what do you recommend for me to add???
        I started suffering from aging syndrome that appeared on my face and blackness under my eyes, and my muscles became smaller and I do not know why ????
        I don’t want to lose my muscle mass after so many years of training and efforts????
        and I’m still taking protein and collagen powder but it doesn’t help.
        I would like to add l Carnosine which needs DMAE or it will show the same aging effect I think you mentioned this before but need a DMAE course is there any other recommendation ?????

        The last question, please when I take NAC, I feel good and strong, my muscles have become very hard and strong, but after 1 hour, I get moody, nervous, aggressive and think a lot to the point of crazy in short Get out of normal, I don’t know why ??????
        I really want to keep taking NAC but why It shows these all side effects, any idea of ​​the brand I take from NOW the company may contain some minerals selenium and molybdenum Should I get another brand what do you recommend ???
        Or is there another alternative
        And why do people think NAC should be a cycle because it dries up all the pimples and water in the body including the eyes and is harmful to the kidneys ????
        and we should take citruline malate and argenine because it decrease the nitric oxide
        Thank you so much i really appreciate all your help and support MrDavid God beless you

        David Tomen
        February 23, 2021

        Tamer, this isn’t something I can do hear. I haven’t the time to devote to studying what you’re trying to do. The only thing I can suggest is scheduling a consultation with me.

Ayumi
November 18, 2020

Hi David,

Thank you for the amazing informations!

I have had a surgery 5 months ago (I am 47) and since then, from time to time i can feel that my memory has a mini black outs (for example, i go to pick something in the kitchen and when i get there i cannot immediately remember what i came for.)

After the surgery my nerves in both arms and legs are lightly aching with thingling sensation, I can feel it especially in the fingers.

Do you think Alpha GPC and CDP Cholin can help restoring my memory and reinforcing my nerves?

I am about to order Super R-lipoic acid from Life extension brand. I’ve listened to one of your videos on youtube about the benefits of lipoic acid and you mentioned that it is also good for detoxifying from some heavy metals (my sensation is that after the surgery – i was operated two times within 48 hour period – the medications I received, like anesthesia are the cause for the current state I am in.

Thank you in advance.

Ayumi

    David Tomen
    November 19, 2020

    Ayumi, you are right about R-Lipoic Acid. I suggest adding Phosphatidylserine (PS) 100 mg 3-times per day, DHA (Omega-3) 1000 mg per day, Lions’ Mane Mushroom 1,000 mg twice per day, a high quality B-Complex and Multivitamin, Alpha GPC 300 mg 3-times per day and L-Tyrosine 500 mg twice per day. Try that stack for a week or two and report back please.

Hakan
July 10, 2020

Hello David,

I can find Choline Chloride in my country. What do you think about it?

Regards

Jason
April 22, 2020

I tried to increase my choline with choline bitartrate 250mg supplement to save cost, it just doesn’t work!!!!!

I will get a decent Citicoline supplement next time.

Tiago
April 10, 2020

David,

I see many stacks/protocols where they use noopept + some racetam + alpha gpc

but I intend to use only noopept + alpha gpc and I didn’t see any protocol or list of how much alpha gpc I should use for both noopept

Which relation to each other do you recommend? the more noopept the more alpha gpc should i use?

Example:
If I want to use 10mg noopept twice a day (20mg total per day), how much alpha gpc should I use together with each dose of noopept?

and if I want to use 15mg noopept twice a day (30mg total per day), how much alpha gpc should I use together with each dose of noopept?

Sorry for bad english

Thanks!

    David Tomen
    April 23, 2020

    Tiago, try 250 – 300 mg Alpha GPC with either dose of Noopept and see if that works. If you get a headache then increase your choline dose.

Mohammad Tahoon
March 15, 2020

Hello David,

I Have a some confusion about my stack and would appreciate a quick fact check:
My goal is to increase attention life span and total study hours, and also increase short and long term memory, so I stick with the stack daily:
– B12& DHA 1 g each daily
– noopept 2*10mg (sublingual due to the low oral bioavailability)
– 2 * 150mg CDP choline or 2*150 Alpha GPC half an hour before noopept
– Uridine monophospahte (100 mg sublingual)

My confusion is UMP & CDP, as you explained CDP will convert to uridine, so i came to the conclusion that i should supplement choline using CDP one day, (alpha gpc + UMP) the other day, this is also because the relative half life of CDP you kindly explained in a previous comment reply.
Does this makes sense or I’m missing important facts

    David Tomen
    March 16, 2020

    Mohammad, you’re on the right track. It makes sense to use Uridine daily when using either CDP-Choline or Alpha GPC. The thing is acetylcholine synthesis is complicated. And you can come at from so many angles. DHA is involved as well as is PS and PC at one time or another. And by “time” I mean micro-seconds depending on what your brain needs at that second.

    All we can do is provide the tools our brain needs to work at its most efficient level. But this is more art than science and we need to learn to ‘listen’ to our bodies. And adjust from the results we’re getting.

    Take a look at a couple of other options at the very top of the first table on this page for more ideas: https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-nootropics/

Jennifer Leon
February 13, 2020

Aloha David, I spent years bedridden a few days a week and if it wasn’t that I was either using my walker or cane. Developing a positive mindset my health improved. It improved even more by taking Acetyl L Carnitine, Resveratrol, Vit B12, Fish Oil, CoQ10, Vit D 5,000, Magesium, and a few other great supplements. I am now back to work full time and even rocking high heels! I was still experiencing some pain, so I added Lion’s Mane at night and now I haven’t been having any pain! I do experience fatigue and brain fog, though. I started taking L-Theanine + Caffiene with coconut oil and Alpha GPC twice a day. Should I also take CDP-Choline along with it? Where I used to be all love-love and peaceful I notice I can get irritable with situations sometimes. Maybe there is a better nootropic stack for me? I hope you can help me with this. Mahalo piha!

    David Tomen
    February 14, 2020

    Jennifer, the irritation is likely coming from your caffeine use because you are not fully supporting it. You also need L-Tyrosine and a good B-Complex because caffeine influences dopamine, norepinephrine and depletes the water-soluble B-Vitamins.

    CDP-Choline will likely help too. For more causes of brain fog, please see this post: https://nootropicsexpert.com/best-supplements-for-brain-fog/

Zak
June 16, 2019

Hey David,

You mention Uridine (“supplemental CDP-Choline provides the uridine needed for PC synthesis.”). Therfore, why not use uridine monophosphate instead of an ingredient such as Alpha GPC or Choline?

I am considering combining DHA, PS, and Uridine monophosphate for memory, brain function, etc. Is this good enough in terms of supplying choline with added benefits? or does every stack require a source such as alpha gpc or cdp choline?

I know this is a lot, and any help would be greatly appreciated. Im a big supporter of you and this site – thank you!

    David Tomen
    June 17, 2019

    Zak, it really depends on how your body and brain use each of these supplements. One person could get the benefit of using just Uridine and the person next to them would respond better to CDP-Choline or both. I personally would not hesitate to use all of them.

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